Stro

[Greg]

No. No that wouldn't

[Drunk Monk]

what about shakira then?

Shakira! SHAKIRA!

[Greg]

Meh.

[Dr. Ivor Yeti]

Watching that film genuinely affected me, just like when we did the interview. It churns deep for me.

[Drunk Monk]

It filled in a lot of gaps for me.  I left the fencing world after college.  Well, I did continue with Gaugler for the paper for a bit, and there was my PhD proposal.  And then there was AFS.  I bailed soon after and that wasn't really the fencing world and lost track of Stro for the most part.  I cannot remember the last time I saw him, sad to say.  I remember hearing of his move to OR, his split with Gay and his move to LA, and PPFY telling that story about his brain tumor, but I didn't hear he had died until much later. Tara was only one so I was focused on family life, and living across from Lam Kwoon. The fencing world was so distant then.  Actually, PPFY was pretty much my sole source of fencing news, and was so until facebook.

I wish I knew Stro in his hippie daze.  While I had leanings in my college years, I didn't really turn on that lifestyle until the late 80s after that.  I was *experienced* when I knew him but he was more coach-like at SJSU. I remember discussing that with him a bit. He had this wacky habit of eating the roach (swallowing the last bit of the joint).  That's just nasty but it destroyed the evidence and might give you a little extra buzz because the roach is heavily resinated.   It was pretty harsh. He be all 'whose gonna eat da roach?' in that accent of his, exaggerated by the high, and we'd all look at him like, "wtf stro?" "Oh I'll fuckin do it!" he say and pop it in his mouth like a tic tac.  Man, I haven't thought about that in years.  I've known countless stoners but he's the only person I've ever known to do that.

[Greg]

Well, that helps. Thank you for your input. It eased some of my fears. No not the one about stumbling upon some footage of DM and the Yeti fencing in some Bondage Bar window. That haunts me always. No, I was afraid I was telling a story about a man who didn't exist to DM and the Yeti.

The one note that did surprise me was that you all wanted an explanation about the three different weapons. I'm glad you liked the AmFen covers. I'd been hating that bit until I revamped it last week. I do like the note on adding a sound effect.

Why don't you like three shots of naked Stro? I actually had that same note in my head. I had redone a section and added him in again and only realized I had three of the same shot later.

I'm glad I'm giving the Yeti the feels.

Thank you again for the feedback.

[Drunk Monk]

No not the one about stumbling upon some footage of DM and the Yeti fencing in some Bondage Bar window. That haunts me always. 

It haunts you?  Well, how the fuck do you think I feel about it?  It remains one of the greatest DOOM pranks ever.  PPFY, bon touche, mon ami.  That one left a scar.  

The one note that did surprise me was that you all wanted an explanation about the three different weapons. 

The fundamentals of fencing must be outlined.  Not a lot of people have actually fenced.  They don't know.  I think all of DOOM has fenced except for cf.  But in the real world, there are more cfs than DOOM fencers.  

Wait...that can't be right.  

Anyway, yeah, lay that groundwork for the naive.  When I'm assembling KFTC, each issue has an article for the know-it-all-self-proclaimed-grandmaster (so many of those in our readership - prolly the bulk of them) and an article for Bubba.  Bubba is that deplorable coors-drinking hick that knows nothing of Kung Fu.  You gotta get his attention most of all because that's pop culture, ya know?

Why don't you like three shots of naked Stro? I actually had that same note in my head. I had redone a section and added him in again and only realized I had three of the same shot later. 

One is great.  That's an amazing photo.  Same with him lunging on the painted car.  Relative to Bubba, you gotta find your audience for this.  Like with The Last Captain, you got the fencers in hand.  Those are parallel to my know-it-all-self-proclaimed-grandmasters.  Bubba is a hard sell.  But the other demographic that's in your easy reach is the iconoclasts and the stoners.  Stro was the epitome of iconoclast but I'm not sure how to court that demographic without pandering.  Stoners are an easy one.  Among stoners, Stro was a hero.  I've always thought about this, but it never really came together until I watched your doc yesterday.  He's almost at the level of a Doc Ellis, only fencing isn't as popular as baseball.  But they both wear knickers... hang on, wth is up with that?  Sorry, I digress.  Back on topic, your doc has such an emphasis on Stro's drug use, you should really play that up.  Add some subtle psychedelic effects like I mentioned before.  That nekkid Stro pic could be easily enhanced with a little rainbow after-image effect and some jam band music.  If you want to capture the spirit of the Haight, I'm your bro, man.  You know that.  

Or you could just drop a tab and rewatch your doc.  Actually, nowadays (and given your level or *experience*) you could probably get adequate inspiration from a nice legal edible.  And you have plenty of space to run amok up there at Lynch Lair.  I'm sure the cats would be amused.  They'd probably respect you more.  

But seriously - cater to the stoners to expand your audience with this.

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[cranefly]

I'm going to rewatch the early portion later today.  That, to me, is the most critical part to get right.  It can set the tone of the piece.
On first viewing, I somehow didn't catch that the old hippie was in fact Stro.  And now I'm unsure of how the whole origin story of Stro unfolded.
So, yeah, I need to revisit that.

But I could see this as the answer to a riddle -- with photos of a very young Stro in the opening, while posing the question of why he is so little known, despite his influence on American fencing, and allusions to the incredible journey he had, and the people he touched, and in so many ways.  The riddle could be tweaked in the stoner direction (as DM said), or expanded to include it.  But however it's done, the opening should couch the whole piece in some way.  The enigma of Stro, or how he was cheated, or his contributions to American fencing, or his mind-trip, or all of these or something else.

I agree with virtually all of DM's suggestions, by the way, though not certain of the stoner angle (I was never a stoner so cannot gauge that).  Oh, and I was okay with the nude Stro three times.  It's a great photo.  Then again, I doubt you want to cater to a perverse audience.

Again, I'll rewatch the early portion later today and report back about whether my above comments still stand or whether I've been talking nonsense.

[Drunk Monk]

Then again, I doubt you want to cater to a perverse audience.

nice try but you are not stealin my monday fencin wonder woman ftw.  

[Greg]

Maybe it just needs more Lynda Carter GIFs?

I am probably the last person to pull off the whole stoner angle.

Did I emphasize the drug use too much in favor of something else?

I am now on the hunt for more Csaba Elthes photos which I think I saw somewhere.

[Drunk Monk]

Maybe it just needs more Lynda Carter GIFs?

if only...

Did I emphasize the drug use too much in favor of something else?

Not at all.  I think that's an important aspect of Stro, one of many, but perhaps it's your general sobriety that makes you miss that.  Actually, I think the time spent on that is just about right.  

Did you ever see that Doc Ellis doc?  I reviewed it - http://www.brotherhoodofdoom.com/doomFor...p?tid=3417 - it's worth your attention because apart from the racism angle, you are grappling many similar themes. It's not a perfect doc - it babbles on at the end - but there's likely a few elements you could poach off it. Give it a gander if you can.


I do agree with cf about the importance of the opening, btw.  It needs to foreshadow more.  The Jungian reference worked for me because I remember how much Stro was into Jung, but that might not really pop out to the casual viewer.  I don't recall a reference to that in your presentation.

[cranefly]

I rewatched the first half of Stro yesterday.  I had previously watched the early part on my laptop with its built-in speaker, which is not optimal, before realizing I could watch it on my HDTV.  The advantage of my HDTV is that I can bluetooth the audio directly into my hearing aids.  This time I watched the first half that way.

On first viewing I had not immediately realized that two of the interviewees were Stro himself at later points in his life.  That distorted my absorption of the presentation.  This time I got a much clearer view of the Jungian framing, which is a valid approach.  There was a side of me that wanted a more linear presentation, where you have Chubby growing up in the Bronx, and there's no clue as to "what comes next," so that the twists and turns in his life are always a surprise.  But to do that, you would likely have to drop the interview footage of Stro later in life, or somehow delay it until the appropriate age (not easy, because he's talking about his early years).  And you don't want to drop any footage of Stro.  So I think the ordering and flow you have right now is very close to optimal.

The one question is the Jungian framing.  While it's a valid way to introduce Stro, I'm not certain it's the best way.

A couple notes.  I had only intended to watch the first ten minutes again, but ended up watching first 45 minutes, and even then had trouble stopping.  That should be taken as a very good sign.  It's a page-turner, or should I say frame-turner.

Oh, and just wondering about the remark that Stro dropped acid daily for a year.  Can you really do that?

[Drunk Monk]

Oh, and just wondering about the remark that Stro dropped acid daily for a year.  Can you really do that?

Some can.  I had heard that story direct from Stro himself.  I've heard it from other heads that have done stuff like that.  Didn't someone here drop every day for a month?  Wasn't me.  

The one question is the Jungian framing.  While it's a valid way to introduce Stro, I'm not certain it's the best way.

I think what's missing here is a strong connection between Jung and Stro.  Stro was deep into Jung.  We discussed it more than a few times.  Did I or PPFY or anyone from the SJSU team the Sword of Compassion story? That's an alchemical reference, Stro's paraphrasing, not a specific thing.  Jung used the two-edged sword as a device and Stro reinterpreted it to justify his balance between war and peace. The SJSU sword of compassion was the attack in prime, which might make an interesting juxtaposition to the parry in seconde story (which works really well between PPFY's, Dean's and my retelling).

[Greg]

I do have the sword of compassion story, the problem is that it's more about DM than about Stro.

[cranefly]

I do have the sword of compassion story, the problem is that it's more about DM than about Stro.

Hey, but that would fit that stunning cover image.  Right?

Yeah, I know.  Do not feed the DM.